Thinking Out Loud

Jim Thornber's Blog

  • About
  • How I became a monk
  • My Book

Alternate Lifestyles and the Attraction of Jesus

Posted by Jim Thornber on July 23, 2010
Posted in: Christian Spirituality, Religion. Tagged: Alternate Lifestyles, Attraction, Christianity, Church, Gay, God, Homosexuality, Jesus, Pastor, Religion, Spirituality. 3 Comments

I had an interesting conversation last summer with a man at a church picnic. Because I had never met him, at first glance I thought he was going through chemotherapy. He wore a knit cap in ninety-degree weather, had no hair on his arms, legs or face, and had penciled in his eyebrows. Only after I sat across from him at lunch did I understand the situation.

After his grandmother introduced me to him, he said, “If you were the pastor of a church, how would you deal with people involved in alternate lifestyles?”

Not wanting to seem presumptuous about where he was heading, I said, “What do you mean?”

He said, “You know, people involved in same sex relationships. You’re from California, so you know what I’m talking about.” A few people at the picnic started to lean in to hear my answer.

I smiled at that and said, “Well, I cannot support a lifestyle that I believe the Bible condemns. However, people involved in alternate lifestyles are always welcome in ‘my’ church. But, by choosing to live in a way that disobeys Scripture, I cannot allow them to be involved in a leadership position. The same would be true for a man who chooses to gamble away his paycheck and then borrows money from his friends for food. My concern is always for the ultimate good of the individual, regardless of their actions.”

Then I said something that seemed to please him. “But I must tell you, I do have one major requirement for a person to come to my church, and if they don’t have this they can’t come. He looked at me as if to say, Here it comes. The other shoe is about to drop.

“In order to come to ‘my’ church,” I said, “a person must be a sinner. Therefore, everyone is welcome.”

The man smiled and said, “Thanks. That’s a good answer. I like that.”

As we were getting in the car to leave, another man came up to me and shook my hand. Continue Reading

Caught In The Good ‘Ol Days

Posted by Jim Thornber on July 19, 2010
Posted in: Christian Spirituality, Religion. Tagged: Athletics, Christianity, Church, Ecumenism, Faith, God, Hebrews, Jesus, Mature, Religion, Running, Scripture, Seniors, Soccer, Spirituality. Leave a comment

“Remember those earlier days after you had received the light, when you stood your ground in a great contest in the face of suffering. . . .because you knew that you yourselves had better and lasting possessions.” Hebrews 10:32-34

When I was in high school I played soccer, which was a strange sport for a guy who didn’t like to run long distances. Being vertically challenged (I’m 5’3″ in two pair of thick socks), I was constantly falling behind the taller guys in the long runs. Because my legs were (well, still are) short, I was quick and usually the first one to the ten-yard line but most always last in the mile. My coach would yell at me for not running fast enough, and I would yell back, “I’m running twice as far as anybody else ’cause I’m taking twice as many steps!” For some reason, he never bought that excuse.

We had to be in excellent shape because in the average soccer game, a player could run up to six miles, and soccer continues to be among the world’s most physically enduring sports. I’m sad to report that I have not maintained that level of conditioning since I left high school. But it was great while it lasted.

Christians also need to be in shape to stay in the “contest” (vs. 32). The Greek word for contest in this verse is athlesis. It refers to an athletic competition and is the source of our English word “athlete.” As Christians, we must not just remember when we were at our best, but we must keep at it and stay that way. We are not to be like the athlete I turned out to be – one who keeps in shape and maintains a peak performance for only a few years, only to grow old and spend time reminiscing about the good ‘ol days when we were on top of our game and the best in the league. Continue Reading

Scriptures That Bother Me — James 4:3

Posted by Jim Thornber on July 13, 2010
Posted in: Christian Spirituality, Religion. Tagged: Assemblies of God, Christianity, Church, Ecumenism, Faith, God, James, Jesus, Pleasure, prayer, Religion, Scripture, Spirituality, Writing. 5 Comments

The Problem With Pleasure

You don’t have what you want because you don’t ask God for it. And even when you ask, you don’t get it because your motives are all wrong—you want only what will give you pleasure. – James 4:3

Annie Dillard said, “As soon as beauty is sought not from religion and love, but for pleasure, it degrades the seeker.” How well I know that to be true.

Just after I got out of Bible College, I took a position as a youth pastor. I wasn’t called to be a youth pastor, didn’t really want to be a youth pastor and did not intend to stay a youth pastor, but my denomination required me to have a ministry position before I could receive my ministerial credentials. So, at the expense of a nice group of kids in a small church in California, I pursued the position for the sheer ego-pleasure of being called “Pastor Jim” and by doing so, removed God and His love from the process.

Sure, I knew God called me to be a minister. But I’m amazed at the deceptive lengths I went to get what I wanted, even taking a position I knew I wasn’t suited for and by doing so, killing the chance another real youth pastor may have had at ministering to those kids. I wanted something and I fought and killed for the pleasure of the pleasure. Oh Lord, please forgive me.

Continue Reading

Scriptures That Bother Me — Romans 5:20

Posted by Jim Thornber on July 8, 2010
Posted in: Christian Spirituality, Religion. Tagged: Apostle Paul, Catholic, Christianity, Church, Ecumenism, Evaluations, Faith, Forgiveness, God, Grace, Jesus, Pride, Religion, Scripture, Spirituality. Leave a comment

God’s Grace vs. Jim’s Pride

“But where sin increased, grace increased all the more” – Romans 5:20

I really despise job performance evaluations. I dread knowing they are coming, for inevitably the person doing the review will find it necessary to point out my weaknesses, errors, mistakes and foibles. And, if they are in a good mood, mention a few of my strengths. Hey, I’m well aware of my shortcomings. I don’t need a yearly reminder by someone who feels they have the privilege to criticize me simply because they sign my paycheck.

Okay, now you know my bad attitude regarding evaluations.

I was talking to God about my attitude the other morning while walking on a treadmill, and somehow it occurred to me that there was a connection between grace, forgiveness, sin and pride. This is how I think it works.

Through every fault of my own, sometimes I find I am in need of another person’s grace and forgiveness (yes, even in a job performance evaluation). Although I am grateful for their kindness and grace, I feel their grace puts me in an awkward position. I couldn’t quite figure it out until I made the connection between forgiveness for something I’ve done wrong, the humility to accept the grace of the person who offers such forgiveness, and my need for forgiveness. The connection is pride.

Continue Reading

The God of Jim

Posted by Jim Thornber on July 6, 2010
Posted in: Christian Spirituality, Religion. Tagged: Christian Spirituality, Christianity, Ecumenism, Faith, God, Hebrews, Jesus, Job, Religion, Satan, Scripture, Spirituality. 2 Comments

“Therefore God is not ashamed to be called their God, for he has prepared a city for them.” – Hebrews 11:16

This verse makes me wonder if God thinks the same way about me. Is God ever ashamed to be called my God? Would He ever refer to Himself as “The God of Jim?” Would he ever point to me, as he did to Job, and ask Satan, “Have you considered my servant, Jim?” (Part of me really hopes that conversation never takes place. I’m quite allergic to boils). Would God ever address other Christians and say, “I am not ashamed to be known as the God of Jim. He is a faithful man, and to his credit I declare him righteous”?

It gives me joy to know that I do not need to be perfect, faultless and without error or sin in order for God to find no shame in being my God. I need only believe in God and obey His word to one day hear Him pronounce, “I was not ashamed to say ‘I am the God of Jim.’”

Naturally, when I think this way it means I’m confident God knows my name. It means I am not forgotten, not abandoned, not just an adopted child hoping God will love me as much as He loves His natural children.

Still, I’ve also thought the opposite. You know, the old There must be better children out there who are more deserving of God’s love than I am kind of thinking.  Continue Reading

A Community of Two

Posted by Jim Thornber on July 1, 2010
Posted in: Christian Spirituality, Religion. Tagged: Assemblies of God, Brothers and Sisters of Charity, Catholic, Christianity, Community Living, Ecumenism, Faith, God, Jesus, Little Portion, Lonliness, Marriage, monasticism, Spirituality. Leave a comment

For four years I was an Assemblies of God minister and a monk with the Brothers and Sisters of Charity at the Little Portion Hermitage. This is an excerpt from   my book, Taking Off My Comfortable Clothes: Removing Religion to Find Relationship.

After I left the Little Portion, many people have asked me why I went there in the first place. Shortly after leaving, my typical answer was, “God wanted to make me a holy man in His sight.” This is true, but that is also God’s agenda in every person’s life.

After Barbara and I started dating and I began seriously thinking about marrying her, I started to see another reason for my time at the community—God wanted to work on certain areas of my life so they would not be a burden to my future wife. The Lord wanted to rid me of as much of my selfishness as possible, because if He was going to entrust me with His daughter, I needed to be in the right spiritual shape in order to treat her as God intended. My time at the Little Portion helped me do that, and it was a girlfriend from high school who showed me that I’d changed.

One time I returned to California on vacation and visited some college friends in San Jose. While I was there, I called my high school girlfriend because I was in the area and I’d never met her husband. We had remained friends since high school and I was looking forward to seeing her. Since this was the first time she saw me in my brown monastic habit, her opening line after a hug and a kiss was, “Well, you’re not hard to spot in a crowd!” As she got ready to leave, she told me she could see a change in me. “I no longer feel like an object in your eyes,” she said.

Okay guys, admit it. When you were (are?) eighteen years old, you have trouble looking at girls in any other manner. Paul may have told Timothy to treat every woman as a sister, but that wasn’t our first choice!

Continue Reading

Is God Enough?

Posted by Jim Thornber on June 28, 2010
Posted in: Christian Spirituality, Religion. Tagged: Brothers and Sisters of Charity, Catholic, Christianity, Ecumenism, Faith, God, Jesus, John Michael Talbot, Monk, Religion, Scripture, Spirituality, Worship. 4 Comments

For four years I was an Assemblies of God minister and a monk with the Brothers and Sisters of Charity. The following is an excerpt from my book Taking Off My Comfortable Clothes: Removing Religion to Find Relationship.

Many times throughout the year, men and women would spend a week at the community to see if the monastic lifestyle was something they felt called to embrace. One time a young man came to the community who played the guitar. That wasn’t unusual. We had many guitar players visit the community, often because they were attracted to John Michael‘s music. What was unusual was what John said about this young man. John and I were discussing the possibility that he might join the community, and John observed, “He is one of the best guitar players I’ve seen, but I cannot tell him that.” Some egos are better left unwatered until the proper time.

Later that week this man and I had a conversation. He was going on and on about how he wanted to use his guitar playing as a ministry, and I remembered what John had said about his talent.

“How do you feel about playing just for God?” I asked.

“What do you mean?” he said.

“Are you content to just sit in a room and play for God with nobody else listening?” I said.

“But I want to play for people,” he said.

“Until God alone is a big enough audience,” I said, “then you aren’t ready to play for people.”

Continue Reading

Can I Be Like Jesus And Be A Pastor?

Posted by Jim Thornber on June 26, 2010
Posted in: Christian Spirituality, Religion. Tagged: Christianity, Church, Faith, Finances, Giving, God, Jesus, Pastor, Religion, Scripture, Spirituality. 4 Comments

A Pharisee invited him to eat with him; so he went in and reclined at the table . . . Then the Lord said to him, “Now you Pharisees clean the outside of the cup and dish, but inside you are full of greed and wickedness.” – Luke 11:37ff

One day, Jesus is walking along, teaching a crowd of people about prayer, Beelzebub, driving out demons and the sign of Jonah, who lived inside a fish for three days. You know, the basics of the faith. Then a Pharisee invites Jesus to eat at his house, so Jesus goes and has a nice lunch, but when He doesn’t wash before the meal the way custom instructed, the Pharisee gets religious with the creator of the universe.

In response to this Pharisee and his concern for traditions over God’s mercy, Jesus tells him and his friends they are filthy cups and fools who are headed towards God’s judgment for the way they chose tradition over relationship. This is the famous passage where Jesus pronounces His “Six Woes” upon the Pharisees and scribes.

It occurred to me that Jesus is actually condemning those who were feeding Him lunch. After accepting an invitation to eat in someone’s home, Jesus turns on the one who fed Him.  In appears that Jesus wasn’t afraid to tell the truth to those who were hosting Him. Could pastors (me included) learn a lesson from this?

How often have pastors been afraid to address certain church issues in fear of offending the generous giver and losing their financial support? Are we, in this manner, placing tithes over truth?

Continue Reading

In Our Right Minds

Posted by Jim Thornber on June 18, 2010
Posted in: Christian Spirituality, Religion. Tagged: Cancer, Christian Spirituality, Dad, Death, Father's Day, God, Heaven, Jesus, Religion, Scripture, Spirituality, Throne. Leave a comment

The phone call came, as they usually do, at an inconvenient time. It was my mom, calling from Mississippi, telling me in Baton Rouge that my dad was in the hospital in California and had cancer. This was definitely not convenient. I called my dad and told him I was flying out in a couple of days to see him. He said he was looking forward to my visit.

My relationship with my dad had been rocky at best for the last twenty-five years, and I was not really looking forward to the trip. It was the right thing to do, but not necessarily the first thing I wanted to do. I was angry and hurt by what took place during and after my parents divorce, and though I wanted answers, I didn’t really want to go through him to get them.

The next day I told my boss about my departure. He asked me how things were, and I gave him a quick version of our relationship. He said, “Sit down. I want to talk to you about my dad, who has bi-polar disease.” We talked for a few minutes, and I said, “Your dad is just like all of us. Not one of us is really in our right minds, are we? For if we were, we wouldn’t live a life that needed a Savior.”

The idea that none of us are in our right minds bothered me, so I began to explore Scripture to support my idea. Continue Reading

Scriptures That Bother Me — Daniel 1:1-5

Posted by Jim Thornber on June 14, 2010
Posted in: Christian Spirituality, Religion. Tagged: 401k, Christianity, Church, Daniel, Ecclesiastes, Faith, God, Investments, Jesus, Mercy, Religion, Scripture, Solomon, Spirituality, Writing. 5 Comments

This Was NOT In My Plans

Nebuchadnezzar king of Babylon came to Jerusalem and besieged it…Then the king ordered Ashpenaz, chief of his court officials, to bring in some of the Israelites from the royal family and the nobility…They were to be trained…to enter the king’s service (Daniel 1:1, 3, 5)

About the time I think my life isn’t going like I planned, I think of Daniel and his three friends. They were well-educated young men who came from successful Israeli families, nobility even, and were handsome and smart. They were the cream of the Jewish crop whose parents carefully planned their careers before they were born. They were well on their way to living the American, no, Israeli dream: Nice job, good home in a decent neighborhood, a quiver of respectable children and a well-tended 401k.

Then King Nebby shows up and ruins their plans. He destroys their town, carries off the golden articles from the Temple, makes eunuchs of the Daniel and the boys (2 Kings 20:18; Isa. 39:7) and carries them to Babylon where they will serve the king until they die, never to see Israel again. And I think, “Well, I may not have everything I ever wanted, but at least I’m not a eunuch in Iraq.” Continue Reading

Posts navigation

← Older Entries
Newer Entries →
  • My Book

    If you want to purchase a copy of my book, click the image.

    This book tells of the lessons I learned as an Assemblies of God minister who was also a monk. For four years I lived with the Brothers and Sister of Charity at the Little Portion Hermitage. I went there because I thought it was unique and would make my spiritual life comfortable. God showed me I had to take off my comfortable clothes and put on the clothes of Christ. You can click the image to learn more and purchase the book.

  • March 2026
    S M T W T F S
    1234567
    891011121314
    15161718192021
    22232425262728
    293031  
    « Feb    
  • Archives

    • February 2026
    • April 2024
    • September 2023
    • October 2022
    • September 2021
    • August 2021
    • July 2021
    • May 2021
    • November 2020
    • October 2020
    • September 2020
    • July 2020
    • June 2020
    • March 2020
    • February 2020
    • December 2019
    • November 2019
    • August 2019
    • July 2019
    • June 2019
    • February 2019
    • December 2018
    • October 2018
    • September 2018
    • August 2018
    • July 2018
    • June 2018
    • May 2018
    • April 2018
    • March 2018
    • December 2017
    • November 2017
    • October 2017
    • August 2017
    • July 2017
    • June 2017
    • May 2017
    • April 2017
    • March 2017
    • February 2017
    • January 2017
    • December 2016
    • November 2016
    • September 2016
    • August 2016
    • July 2016
    • June 2016
    • May 2016
    • April 2016
    • March 2016
    • February 2016
    • December 2015
    • November 2015
    • September 2015
    • August 2015
    • July 2015
    • June 2015
    • May 2015
    • April 2015
    • March 2015
    • February 2015
    • January 2015
    • December 2014
    • November 2014
    • October 2014
    • September 2014
    • August 2014
    • July 2014
    • June 2014
    • May 2014
    • April 2014
    • March 2014
    • February 2014
    • January 2014
    • December 2013
    • November 2013
    • October 2013
    • September 2013
    • August 2013
    • July 2013
    • June 2013
    • May 2013
    • April 2013
    • March 2013
    • February 2013
    • January 2013
    • December 2012
    • November 2012
    • October 2012
    • September 2012
    • August 2012
    • July 2012
    • June 2012
    • May 2012
    • April 2012
    • March 2012
    • February 2012
    • January 2012
    • December 2011
    • November 2011
    • October 2011
    • September 2011
    • August 2011
    • July 2011
    • June 2011
    • May 2011
    • April 2011
    • March 2011
    • February 2011
    • January 2011
    • December 2010
    • November 2010
    • October 2010
    • September 2010
    • August 2010
    • July 2010
    • June 2010
    • May 2010
    • April 2010
    • March 2010
    • February 2010
    • January 2010
    • December 2009
    • November 2009
    • October 2009
    • September 2009
    • August 2009
    • July 2009
    • June 2009
    • May 2009
    • April 2009
    • March 2009
    • February 2009
    • January 2009
    • December 2008
    • November 2008
    • October 2008
  • Blogroll

    • Archie
    • bbgcmac
    • Bellissimanh
    • Beth Sciallo
    • Brothers And Sisters of Charity
    • George Cannon
    • internet monk
    • Kin Robles
    • natalie spera
  • Recent Posts

    • This Angel Didn’t Have Wings
    • An Abundance to Give
    • Why Jesus Christ Is NOT My Personal Lord and Savior
    • Thank You For Saying, “Thank You”
    • The Day My Grandmother Talked To Me About Sex
  • Recent Comments

    Henry Andrews's avatarHenry Andrews on Our Four-Minute Fling in First…
    Jim Thornber's avatarJim Thornber on Scriptures That Bother Me…
    Nicole's avatarNicole on Scriptures That Bother Me…
    Eva's avatarEva on When God is Silent
    Rosemary Q's avatarRosemary Q on A Poor Widow’s Rich Offer…
  • Pages

    • About
    • How I became a monk
    • My Book
  • RSS Thinking Out Loud

    • This Angel Didn’t Have Wings
    • An Abundance to Give
    • Why Jesus Christ Is NOT My Personal Lord and Savior
    • Thank You For Saying, “Thank You”
    • The Day My Grandmother Talked To Me About Sex
    • A Lesson in Love
    • God Doesn’t Owe Me An Apology
    • No Wishing Allowed
    • This Is NOT My Money
    • Comfort Is Not The Agenda
  • Abraham alone Angels Apostle Paul Assemblies of God Blood Brothers and Sisters of Charity Calvary Cancer Catholic Catholicism Cats Character Christianity Christian Spirituality Christmas Church Colossians Community Living Compassion Confession Death Demons Disciples Divorce Ecumenism Exodus Faith Forgiveness Galatians Genesis Gifts Giving God Gratitude Heaven Hebrews International Pentecostal Holiness Church James Jesus Job John Michael Talbot Joy Leadership Little Portion Love Luke Mark Twain Marriage Mary Matthew Miracles monasticism Money Monk Moses Music Noah Obedience Oswald Chambers Pastor prayer Prodigal Son Publishing Religion Romans Salvation Savior Scripture Service Solomon Spiritual Gifts Spirituality Worship Writing
  • Top Posts

    • Scriptures That Bother Me -- Matthew 14:28-30
    • The Day My Grandmother Talked To Me About Sex
    • The Never-Ridden Donkey
    • Scriptures That Bother Me -- Matthew 14:13-21; 15:32-38
    • Scriptures That Bother Me -- Hebrews 11:16
    • Why Jesus Christ Is NOT My Personal Lord and Savior
    • Scriptures That Bother Me -- John 13:1,4
    • Scriptures That Bother Me -- Luke 21:2-4
    • Giving Thanks
    • Gnawing On God
  • Meta

    • Create account
    • Log in
    • Entries feed
    • Comments feed
    • WordPress.com
Create a free website or blog at WordPress.com.
Thinking Out Loud
Create a free website or blog at WordPress.com.
Privacy & Cookies: This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this website, you agree to their use.
To find out more, including how to control cookies, see here: Cookie Policy
  • Subscribe Subscribed
    • Thinking Out Loud
    • Join 260 other subscribers
    • Already have a WordPress.com account? Log in now.
    • Thinking Out Loud
    • Subscribe Subscribed
    • Sign up
    • Log in
    • Report this content
    • View site in Reader
    • Manage subscriptions
    • Collapse this bar
 

Loading Comments...